Location: Episode 10 | Strange Things Happen at the One Two Point

Discussion: I'm getting somewhat dismayed...Reported This is a featured thread

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GermaricanMix
GermaricanMix
40. RE: I'm getting somewhat dismayed...
Dec 1 2008, 6:13 PM EST | Post edited: Dec 1 2008, 6:13 PM EST
"Though he cant all of a sudden become G.I. Joe, i still think he character has to toughen up somewhat.
"
I really wanna see a progression. I loved Goodbye To All That cause I think that was a setting that he really could've benefited from. I think there needs to be another boys only adventure, or boys plus terminator if you will. Both John and Derek's main plot points right now are how they're being deceived by two girlfriends from the future.
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Schmacky
Schmacky
41. RE: I'm getting somewhat dismayed...
Dec 1 2008, 6:24 PM EST | Post edited: Dec 1 2008, 6:24 PM EST
I see a lot of this thinking that John needs to be trained by Derek... is it because he's a guy? Or because he's from the future and knows stuff? If it's the second I think Sarah should go along with that training too. She might die of cancer, but shouldn't she train for the future as well?

But I want to see SARAH train John on something because that's her legend so let's see her legend in action.
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GermaricanMix
GermaricanMix
42. RE: I'm getting somewhat dismayed...
Dec 1 2008, 6:32 PM EST | Post edited: Dec 1 2008, 6:32 PM EST
"I see a lot of this thinking that John needs to be trained by Derek... is it because he's a guy? Or because he's from the future and knows stuff? If it's the second I think Sarah should go along with that training too. She might die of cancer, but shouldn't she train for the future as well?

But I want to see SARAH train John on something because that's her legend so let's see her legend in action."
For me personally it's that I like their interactions a lot AND that he's from the future and knows stuff. I also think he'd be harder on John than Sarah would be. I can definitely see her training John but I think Derek would push him more cause he doesn't have that mother instinct, you know? As far as Sarah going along with the training, I don't think that's a good idea. It would either have to be only John and Derek or only Sarah and Derek. When it's all three there's too much protectiveness going on. When Derek mentioned that John's head isn't in the game Sarah got all defensive and made excuses for him. When Derek pointed out the whole three dots thing John got all defensive, so I think they'd have to be separated for them to actually get pushed. I think they need to utilize Derek more in general. He's from the future, he's from what they're trying to prevent. I'd sit his butt down and get every bit of information I could. Granted, he lies like a rug, but so far only about personal things.
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Schmacky
Schmacky
43. RE: I'm getting somewhat dismayed...
Dec 1 2008, 6:39 PM EST | Post edited: Dec 1 2008, 6:39 PM EST
"For me personally it's that I like their interactions a lot AND that he's from the future and knows stuff. I also think he'd be harder on John than Sarah would be. I can definitely see her training John but I think Derek would push him more cause he doesn't have that mother instinct, you know? As far as Sarah going along with the training, I don't think that's a good idea. It would either have to be only John and Derek or only Sarah and Derek. When it's all three there's too much protectiveness going on. When Derek mentioned that John's head isn't in the game Sarah got all defensive and made excuses for him. When Derek pointed out the whole three dots thing John got all defensive, so I think they'd have to be separated for them to actually get pushed. I think they need to utilize Derek more in general. He's from the future, he's from what they're trying to prevent. I'd sit his butt down and get every bit of information I could. Granted, he lies like a rug, but so far only about personal things."
I agree and disagree.

Good points on it just being Derek and one of them, but not both at the same time. They do pounce to defend one another.

Disagree on Derek being able to be harder on John than Sarah would because of mother instinct. From the first episode I knew Sarah was not the type to let up on John because of this so-called motherly nature that she so obviously does not have. In the pilot when John said it was safe Sarah grabs him so rough and yells at him that no where is safe. From that I do not ever see her "letting up" in any sort of way when it's training time.
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GermaricanMix
GermaricanMix
44. RE: I'm getting somewhat dismayed...
Dec 1 2008, 6:51 PM EST | Post edited: Dec 1 2008, 6:51 PM EST
"Disagree on Derek being able to be harder on John than Sarah would because of mother instinct. From the first episode I knew Sarah was not the type to let up on John because of this so-called motherly nature that she so obviously does not have. In the pilot when John said it was safe Sarah grabs him so rough and yells at him that no where is safe. From that I do not ever see her "letting up" in any sort of way when it's training time. "
Yes, you're right. I did think of that exact scene right after I posted my comment. I guess I shouldn't have said mother instincts. I guess I can see Derek being more physically demanding during training while Sarah is much more emotionally demanding. By that I mean I can see Derek letting John hurt himself to get a point across (as long as he's 100% sure it wouldn't be life threatening) where as I think Sarah would keep him from hurting himself but pointing out exactly how he COULD have hurt himself and what that would mean for the future and how that needs to be avoided at all cost.

I also think it's a perception thing for John. I think at this point he might be more willing to go along with Derek training him cause he's a male influence. He hasn't had a father figure and an uncle is pretty damn close. Also, he's rebelling against his mom right now so everything she says will most likely be met with "Why? Why can't I do it my way? My ways just as good. You're just pissed cause it's not YOUR way" It's not exactly fair, but I can see that being an issue.
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Schmacky
Schmacky
45. RE: I'm getting somewhat dismayed...
Dec 1 2008, 7:17 PM EST | Post edited: Dec 1 2008, 7:17 PM EST
"Yes, you're right. I did think of that exact scene right after I posted my comment. I guess I shouldn't have said mother instincts. I guess I can see Derek being more physically demanding during training while Sarah is much more emotionally demanding. By that I mean I can see Derek letting John hurt himself to get a point across (as long as he's 100% sure it wouldn't be life threatening) where as I think Sarah would keep him from hurting himself but pointing out exactly how he COULD have hurt himself and what that would mean for the future and how that needs to be avoided at all cost.

I also think it's a perception thing for John. I think at this point he might be more willing to go along with Derek training him cause he's a male influence. He hasn't had a father figure and an uncle is pretty damn close. Also, he's rebelling against his mom right now so everything she says will most likely be met with "Why? Why can't I do it my way? My ways just as good. You're just pissed cause it's not YOUR way" It's not exactly fair, but I can see that being an issue."
Those are good points. But, when I said I wanted to see Sarah train him, I don't necessarily mean train a 16 year old boy. John already knows a lot of stuff, I wanna see how and when he learned those things. Lil flashbacks would be awesome.
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GermaricanMix
GermaricanMix
46. RE: I'm getting somewhat dismayed...
Dec 1 2008, 7:51 PM EST | Post edited: Dec 1 2008, 7:51 PM EST
"Those are good points. But, when I said I wanted to see Sarah train him, I don't necessarily mean train a 16 year old boy. John already knows a lot of stuff, I wanna see how and when he learned those things. Lil flashbacks would be awesome."
Oh, okay. In that case I completely agree. I'd love to see some flashbacks.
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sephiroth86
sephiroth86
47. RE: I'm getting somewhat dismayed...
Dec 2 2008, 11:54 PM EST | Post edited: Dec 2 2008, 11:54 PM EST
I have this nagging idea that John may not even be a millitary leader but more of a master tactician, it seems like in T2 and TSCC john is shown to have a keen sense of skill with computers the way he hacked that ATM machine in T2 and he is reprogramming the terminators in the future all the time.I'm beginning to wonder is he even supposed to be a general at all,or is he meant to be a master hacker of some sort.It is stated that he is very reclusive in the future with cameron being the only one to spend any real time with him.John may not be a general at all, he probably just hacks into skynet to find out what they are doing so the resistance can organize their troops accordingly, He may also be sympathizing with the machines he has captured and may be working to find some level of peace between the humans and the machines, this would be very controversial to the human resistance thus his high level of seclusion, it's just one idea I have that would be a good plot twist 3  out of 3 found this valuable. Do you?    
Zadokite
Zadokite
48. RE: I'm getting somewhat dismayed...
Dec 4 2008, 5:32 AM EST | Post edited: Dec 4 2008, 5:32 AM EST
Heya,

First of all, welcome back Schmacky. I hope you had a great trip.

Secondly, check out Terminator 3 to see a whiny John Connor. At the start of the first season I was relieved that John's demeanor fell between Nick Stahl's and Edward Furlong's portrayls of John. If John would have been as whiny as Nick's portrayl, I'd of had a dificult time staying with the show.

John Connor has been showing leadership in this series. In Strange things happen at the one two point, John heard both Derek and Sarah's arguments pro and con about pursuing this set of information.

John made the decision on his own to make a cover for Sarah to investigate the A.I.company as a possible lead to Skynet. This was a command decision he made on his own. He has made numerous decisions on his own throughout the series. If one were to take the time to review it, one could see it.

John is moving forward. He's making many of his own decisions. Some of them are bad, but we learn from our mistakes (most of us.) I'm satisfied with his progression.

Thanks,

Zad
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Mappalazarou
Mappalazarou
49. RE: I'm getting somewhat dismayed...
Dec 4 2008, 11:41 AM EST | Post edited: Dec 4 2008, 11:41 AM EST
Can't say I agree with some of the negativity towards John. I think that the reason they leave future John shrouded in mystery is because the future, in the show, is. We don't know if the future John Connor is the same 16 year old protagonist who leads the series. They've already explained that the future can change because of actions in the present.

I, for one, admire the mystery. I think that going for the boring, predictable John-Connor-heroic-legend type character would only bring a show this in-depth down on its knees.
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Schmacky
Schmacky
50. RE: I'm getting somewhat dismayed...
Dec 4 2008, 12:07 PM EST | Post edited: Dec 4 2008, 12:07 PM EST
"Can't say I agree with some of the negativity towards John. I think that the reason they leave future John shrouded in mystery is because the future, in the show, is. We don't know if the future John Connor is the same 16 year old protagonist who leads the series. They've already explained that the future can change because of actions in the present.

I, for one, admire the mystery. I think that going for the boring, predictable John-Connor-heroic-legend type character would only bring a show this in-depth down on its knees."
I agree.

I know _why_ and understand why they make FutureJohn so questionable, but that doesn't mean I have to like it :P
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