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Discussion: Why Ratings are Good for TSCC
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caeroe |
20. RE: Why Ratings are Good for TSCC
Apr 7 2009, 8:10 PM EDT
| Post edited: Apr 7 2009, 8:11 PM EDT
"http://terminatorwiki.fox.com/thread/2532168/Fox+Vice+President+defends+TSCC+and+%27values%27+DVR+viewings+!%3F!Still irrelevant. Unless you can provide definitive proof that advertisers value DVR numbers, my point still stands. The sponsors use Nielsen ratings, Fox follows suit. Do you find this valuable? |
eXecutex |
21. RE: Why Ratings are Good for TSCC
Apr 7 2009, 8:19 PM EDT
You guys don't understand.Fox decides cancellation not advertisers. For advertises a demo is a demo YES... but for Fox, ratings are sort of an indication of a show, but if they're not careful they will make mistakes like Firefly and some argue Arrested dev? The idea is, getting as many viewers as possible. TSCC is a different demographic than a lot of Fox's shows. Fringe is the only other show that brings in similar demographics of TSCC... If fox wants to increase it's viewers as a total number, they need to work on all demographics. In addition, low ratings can be an indication of bad performance. IF they put for example, 24 on Fridays at 8, and they put TSCC on Mondays at 9, maybe 24 will drop total viewers, but maybe TSCC will largely increase its audience. But maybe as a total result of viewers, Fox gains another 2 million viewers... This would be a win win situation for them in terms of advertisement revenue. The current ratings show that TSCC is simply on the wrong time slot and would do better if it was led in by American Idol or some other high ranking show. IT would also be a mistake for Fox to think that T4, and later T5 would not provide a constant new stream of Terminator fans that become TSCC fans. For dollhouse, I don't think it stands a chance, it's in its first season and doing incredibly poorly even with all the hype and whedon juice... TSCC however, has potential to achieve it's season 1 ratings, and more as the story can alter itself, evolve, and is already an internet cult hit. 4 out of 7 found this valuable. Do you? |
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sugaki |
22. RE: Why Ratings are Good for TSCC
Apr 7 2009, 8:23 PM EDT
Uh, I think you guys are blowing Fox VP's comments waaay out of proportion. She's saying "clearly there is some value to [DVR viewership]"... and NOT "this show is doing awesome" or "we'll never cancel this show" or "we're going to continue this because of awesome DVR numbers."Her point is true, that there is some value to DVR viewership. However, that value is considerably less than Nielsen's numbers. And if Nielsen's numbers don't measure up, it's in trouble. Another sign it's in trouble is when you watch episodes on Fox On Demand--there are no ads, which means there's not enough buyers to where sales can sell ad slots. Whether you absolutely love the show or not, the reality still stands that TSCC's ratings are VERY BAD. It's best to assume the show's getting canceled, as that's the logical conclusion to draw. That's not being a hater, that's just being realistic. 2 out of 4 found this valuable. Do you? |
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sugaki |
23. RE: Why Ratings are Good for TSCC
Apr 7 2009, 8:29 PM EDT
"You guys don't understand.No, either you don't understand the world of advertising, or your rabid devotion to the show blinds you of the simple reality. Fox decides cancellation BASED ON advertising revenue. Fox isn't producing shows for charity, they're doing it for money. Money comes from advertising. The demo is THE MOST important, because it's the age group that has the most disposable income. Disposable income means the viewer is more likely to buy the product a person advertises. 10-year old TImmy enjoying TSCC doesn't really impress an advertiser, as Timmy's product purchases depends on mommy. I don't think you understand how sales/advertising works. And of course low ratings are an indication of bad performance, how could they not be?? If I were Fox, I'd can TSCC, sorry. It doesn't have the viewership numbers to justify keeping it afloat, and it's not worth the risk to dump another show (say Fringe, which does suck) and give TSCC a better slot. That's just business. 4 out of 7 found this valuable. Do you? |
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eXecutex |
24. RE: Why Ratings are Good for TSCC
Apr 7 2009, 8:30 PM EDT
"Uh, I think you guys are blowing Fox VP's comments waaay out of proportion. She's saying "clearly there is some value to [DVR viewership]"... and NOT "this show is doing awesome" or "we'll never cancel this show" or "we're going to continue this because of awesome DVR numbers."IT's also best to assume 24 is canceled, that way when we predictably see a season 8 we can say... "omg wow! exciting! I didn't think it could happen!" It's the stupidest thing you can do to tell people how "doomed" the show is. Not only are you a bad news deliverer, but even if you are right, you aren't helping anyone by stating the obvious. But if you find information or arguments that could give you the hope that there could be a season 3, then it would be interesting information. Saying the show is doomed beyond any hope, is one step worse from cancellation rumor blogs... because at least they earn money for their trouble, while you only receive the insults. 1 out of 2 found this valuable. Do you? |
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eXecutex |
25. RE: Why Ratings are Good for TSCC
Apr 7 2009, 8:33 PM EDT
@sugaki,The low ratings are directly caused by time slot... They are not caused by the shows quality. The argument you're making is post hoc ergo ad hoc... Just because you think they are correlated doesn't mean they have a cause-effect relationship. The statistics are there... It's not "rabid devotion" it's using logic far superior than yours obviously and actually doing the calculation. TSCC never bled viewers, it's fluctuated much like Fringe fluctuated as well. If I were to use a more scientific statistical analysis, I would find TSCC more successful than Fringe and Dollhouse. 0 out of 1 found this valuable. Do you? |
tk1000 |
26. RE: Why Ratings are Good for TSCC
Apr 7 2009, 8:35 PM EDT
"Remember, Prison Break wasn't canceled for Season 4, it was decided to be ended by the writers. The story resolved itself.hehe, how many times could they break out of prison. 2 out of 2 found this valuable. Do you? |
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eXecutex |
27. RE: Why Ratings are Good for TSCC
Apr 7 2009, 8:39 PM EDT
Exactly, I was sort of shocked when they first made the series, because I was thinking "what happens after they break out?"
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darkman_2 |
28. RE: Why Ratings are Good for TSCC
Apr 7 2009, 9:52 PM EDT
| Post edited: Apr 7 2009, 9:53 PM EDT
TSCC, if you also include dvr numbers, is doing almost as well as the X-FIles in their second season also. But the X-files never had to worry much about online/ internet and DVR.Most of the great shows took about 3 seasons before they becaome a super-duper hit. TSCC is gaining viewers in the stretch run which is a positive. I believe if TSCC gets a season 3, Josh Friedman and crew, with all they have learn from season 1 & 2, will knock it out the park, which is a good thing for non-baseball fans. :D 1 out of 1 found this valuable. Do you? |
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Veran |
29. RE: Why Ratings are Good for TSCC
Apr 7 2009, 9:56 PM EDT
"TSCC, if you also include dvr numbers, is doing almost as well as the X-FIles in their second season also. But the X-files never had to worry much about online/ internet and DVR.Which is why FOX needs to give it one more chance to come back strong. 1 out of 1 found this valuable. Do you? |
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eXecutex |
30. RE: Why Ratings are Good for TSCC
Apr 7 2009, 10:25 PM EDT
Hope so... I mean if there was ever a chance for a ratings-gone-low show to survive another season... TSCC has the best chance amongst all those shows.
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stark74 |
31. RE: Why Ratings are Good for TSCC
Apr 7 2009, 10:29 PM EDT
According to Final numbers this week, this is the second week that TSSC has more total live+SD viewers than dollhouse, but dolhouse has better demo numbers..this week: TSSC 3469 1.3/5 dollhouse 3435 1.5/5 last week TSSC 3868 1.3/4 dollhouse 3859 1.4/4 Do you find this valuable? |
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eXecutex |
32. RE: Why Ratings are Good for TSCC
Apr 7 2009, 10:36 PM EDT
That's very interesting stark, damn you are so right on: http://tvbythenumbers.com/category/ratings/top-shows-by-network/fox-tv-ratings dollhouse fans must be going nuts... Do you find this valuable? |
The_GodfatherSJP |
33. RE: Why Ratings are Good for TSCC
Apr 7 2009, 10:37 PM EDT
Well, sugaki does have a point. I don't think it's pessimistic to say that it's unlikely FOX will renew the show. I could see it happening if WB offers FOX the series cheaply again, it's what's keeping a sitcom called 'Til Death on the air. If FOX can turn a profit, even with the low advertising revenue, they'll keep the show for another season. If the show is as critically acclaimed as it appears to be, they might give it another half season and it may survive longer if it has the backing of important execs at FOX. Cheers is an example of this, it was a critic's darling but VERY low rated in its first seasons. NBC gave it an extra season (two actually) because critics thought so highly of it. They knew it was good, and eventually gave it a slot where it became a huge hit. Their research found a night where the show could thrive.It actually wouldn't surprise me that WB is trying hard to keep the show alive. It's another source of revenue for a blockbuster franchise. I'll bet you anything that WB is convinced T4 is going to be a commercial AND critical success, and it won't take much to bring the FOX execs around to this. I suspect we got the back 9 BECAUSE of the movie. If these corporations believe they have a very good but low rated show on their hands they won't just give up on it, especially WB. Do you find this valuable? |
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eXecutex |
34. RE: Why Ratings are Good for TSCC
Apr 7 2009, 10:52 PM EDT
I don't see why WB wouldn't do everything in their power. The show promotes the movie, and the movie promotes the show.It's a win win for them, even if Fox doesn't accept, another network would. Do you find this valuable? |
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The_GodfatherSJP |
35. RE: Why Ratings are Good for TSCC
Apr 7 2009, 11:22 PM EDT
"That's very interesting stark,Have you guys noticed that both Dollhouse and TSCC are down from the same amount versus last week? I've got 2 possibilities for this: 1) Last weekend was the premiere of The Fast and the Furious which was number 1 at the box office and certainly pulls some of our viewer audience away (same thing happened with Watchmen) 2) March Sweeps ended the last week of March. Why would there be such a difference when diaries are included vs. being excluded (normal "polling" this week is just boxes right)? Do you find this valuable? |
Meat_Cutter |
36. RE: Why Ratings are Good for TSCC
Apr 7 2009, 11:43 PM EDT
Compared to any other science fiction program, the ratings are good. FOX has blundered it though by constantly changing the times and poorly advertising it. Combine with a poor night and no lead-in, you have a recipe for diaster.TSCC would be a killer on the sci-fi channel. 1 out of 1 found this valuable. Do you? |
noodloid |
37. RE: Why Ratings are Good for TSCC
Apr 7 2009, 11:47 PM EDT
"Have you guys noticed that both Dollhouse and TSCC are down from the same amount versus last week? I've got 2 possibilities for this:I'll tack on one more possibility: in many parts of the U.S. (including the part where I live...) this week between Palm Sunday and Easter is always spring break for public schools. This would obviously have a greater impact on family audiences, which is actually supported by the fact that the show didn't lose its demo share this week. Basically, among those who were home to watch and be counted, it did about the same as always, there were just fewer home to watch and be counted. This brings me to sad fact #1: many of those people may well have watched - just not from home, and those who had Nielsen PeopleMeters at home don't have them at the beach house or hotel. Sad fact #2: Those who didn't see Friday's episode may well have recorded it on DVR, but if they don't get home from vacation and watch it by Thursday, their recordings won't count toward the Live+7 ratings we've been praising for weeks now. And sad fact #3: Spring break ain't over... Assuming vacation really is the primary reason for this week's ratings dip, those viewers are probably not coming home until Saturday or Sunday - I'm a pretty big fan of this show, but even I gotta take my beach time when I can get it. Do you find this valuable? |
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eXecutex |
38. RE: Why Ratings are Good for TSCC
Apr 8 2009, 12:01 AM EDT
The reason viewership is not as high for Adam Raised the Cain is simple:There is 4-5 million LESS Viewers on Friday April 3, than on March 27 friday. Hence the statistical drop. Otherwise it would have been up at 4 million range. Do you find this valuable? |
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sugaki |
39. RE: Why Ratings are Good for TSCC
Apr 8 2009, 1:38 AM EDT
"It's the stupidest thing you can do to tell people how "doomed" the show is. Not only are you a bad news deliverer, but even if you are right, you aren't helping anyone by stating the obvious. But if you find information or arguments that could give you the hope that there could be a season 3, then it would be interesting information.Two things. First, when I say it's likely to be canceled, that's just being realistic. I never said it was "doomed", that's just your fanboy ego getting hurt talking. Chances are it'll get canned, that's just an objective analysis of how the show's doing, and Fox's typical reaction to shows that don't do well. I'm being realistic, you're shoving your head in the sand pretending the show's doing fine. Who is the stupid one? Second, the ratings going lower are NOT due to just being moved to Friday. Yes, Friday kills viewership numbers. But if you look at the performance, it keeps dropping even more. From the very beginning of the show, there's a general downward trend, even when it was on Mondays. That's a sign interest is waning. When it's only 4th in popularity on a crappy timeslot, that's a really bad sign. I'm thinking in Fox's eyes, they gave plenty of chances to let this TV series take off. They renewed it for season 2 in spite of dropping viewership, they ordered the back 9 episodes in spite of dropping ratings. They're probably thinking they gave it enough chances. If I'm wrong I'll be pleasantly surprised. But to say that the ratings are GOOD for TSCC? That's delusional, plain and simple. 1 out of 1 found this valuable. Do you? |
