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IntrepidVillain |
22. RE: TSCC SEASON 3: YOU WRITE THE STORY! (part 2)
Jun 20 2009, 2:07 PM EDT
"Ellison: "So where do you go?"Hey, jose_t800 wait. Cut, take 3. Can we remind? Is that ok? I think you might be forgetting something. Cameron is still in the basement and Ellison is supposed to pick up Savannah from school/kindergarten/child care. Here's a suggestion: Horrified with her son John's reckless decision to follow Cameron into the future, she realises that she will have to accept that she can't rely on her son to defeat Skynet before J-Day. She is disappointed that he won't be around to participate in the struggle. In the meantime, she looks around the room and realises that Cromartie/Laslo was hooked up to the Turk. Curious, she decides to find out what is going to happen if she plugs him into the Turk. During that time, Ellison returns with Savannah and she and Cameron Henry sit at the table and sing, "Donald, where's your trousers?" Zeira Corp becomes Sarah's new home. Savannah inherits the company from her mother and Ellison continues to teach Cameron Henry about human ethics. Meanwhile, John Connor starts a search for his namesake John Phillips. 7 out of 8 found this valuable. Do you? |
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Timeloop |
23. RE: TSCC SEASON 3: YOU WRITE THE STORY! (part 2)
Jun 20 2009, 2:28 PM EDT
The 3 AI that went to the future are planning to return with JC to the past. That means their mission is entirely about what they can get from that future and not about that future itself since it will cease to exist for them as soon as they return to 2009.That fact should be the starting point for building a s3 storyline. The TSCC story from a time travel perspective has multiple future time threads feeding a shared past with time travellers to create a new timeline. 6 out of 9 found this valuable. Do you? |
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1crazedterminator |
24. RE: TSCC SEASON 3: YOU WRITE THE STORY!
Jun 20 2009, 2:57 PM EDT
"Scot, you are crazier than a Pomeranian being radically controlled by a T-900!"i don't know," Kyle murmured, turning away from the others, "but something about that kid gives me the creeps. Who's watching him?" Alison and John henry exchange looks. Kyle whips around to face them and glares. "get some metal on him, we don't want him getting away." Alison grimaces and hurries off. :) 8 out of 8 found this valuable. Do you? |
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arthur1920 |
25. RE: TSCC SEASON 3: YOU WRITE THE STORY! (part 2)
Jun 20 2009, 4:21 PM EDT
What bothers me about time travel is the notion that you can see yourself the way Derek saw himself playing catch with Kyle. So if you can be in two places a t once,...which one has the soul? Just asking
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General_Mazaki |
26. RE: TSCC SEASON 3: YOU WRITE THE STORY! (part 2)
Jun 20 2009, 7:09 PM EDT
"What bothers me about time travel is the notion that you can see yourself the way Derek saw himself playing catch with Kyle. So if you can be in two places a t once,...which one has the soul? Just asking"Both of them. The soul doesn't change: only the mind. 6 out of 6 found this valuable. Do you? |
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Timeloop |
29. RE: TSCC SEASON 3: YOU WRITE THE STORY! (part 2)
Jun 21 2009, 2:33 AM EDT
"Both. The fact that they're in two places at once doesn't change a thing. For those who have an understanding of physics, there is no separation between past, present and future. It's like asking, which one of me has the soul-- the me of yesterday, the me of today, or the me of tomorrow? They are all one and the same."TSCC time travel seems consistent with http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Many-worlds_interpretation#Time_travel . Time travel The many-worlds interpretation could be one possible way to resolve the paradoxes that one would expect to arise if time travel turns out to be permitted by physics (permitting closed timelike curves and thus violating causality). Entering the past would itself be a quantum event causing branching, and therefore the timeline accessed by the time traveller simply would be another timeline of many. In that sense, it would make the Novikov self-consistency principle unnecessary. 5 out of 7 found this valuable. Do you? |
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Valor.D |
30. RE: TSCC SEASON 3: YOU WRITE THE STORY! (part 2)
Jun 21 2009, 3:26 AM EDT
| Post edited: Jun 21 2009, 3:28 AM EDT
"TSCC time travel seems consistent with http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Many-worlds_interpretation#Time_travel .Yes. One tenet of Quantum Mechanics is that "anything which can occur, does occur in alternate realities". The concept of "time paradoxes" destroying the universe (a la "Back to the Future") is antiquated with the understanding of "the many-worlds model". This model is the answer to the old riddle of: "What if I built a time machine and went back in time to meet my own Grandfather? We get into a fight, and I accidentally kill him before conceiving my Father. If my Grandfather is killed, how can I ever be born? If I am never born, how can I build a time machine to go back to meet and kill him?" Killing my Grandfather creates an alternate reality-- one which I am neither from, nor ever existed. 5 out of 6 found this valuable. Do you? |
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AlisonYoung |
31. RE: TSCC SEASON 3: YOU WRITE THE STORY! (part 2)
Jun 21 2009, 7:13 AM EDT
Can't we just get on with the story?!
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daxius_x |
32. RE: TSCC SEASON 3: YOU WRITE THE STORY! (part 2)
Jun 21 2009, 12:31 PM EDT
"Can't we just get on with the story?!"AGREED. It was several days after the strange boy, John Connor, had appeared to the Resistance soldiers. Allison stretched her arms, absent-mindedly thinking about how strangely familiar he looked, as she finished off her early-morning guard shift. Polo, her watchdog, woofled quietly, turning it's head back down the corridor. Allison looked up to see a figure approach, and she smiled... 7 out of 8 found this valuable. Do you? |
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Valor.D |
33. RE: TSCC SEASON 3: YOU WRITE THE STORY! (part 2)
Jun 21 2009, 1:41 PM EDT
"Derek enters the room and pulls up a tattered and bent metal chair, sitting on it backwards, he smiles softly at Allison, "He's still out, huh?" "Yeah", Allison answers, as she scratches Polo's head, "Kyle must have hit him pretty hard". Derek turns back to John and reaches into his satchel, retrieving a small silver flask, he unscrews it and takes a drink. "You can go now, Allison." Derek states bluntly, his gaze fixating on the prisoner. 6 out of 7 found this valuable. Do you? |
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MetalShifter |
35. RE: TSCC SEASON 3: YOU WRITE THE STORY! (part 2)
Jun 21 2009, 2:01 PM EDT
| Post edited: Jun 21 2009, 2:09 PM EDT
"Derek pulls out his gun and kills the sleeping John Connor.??? Sweet! Read the disclaimer, you troll! I am of the strong opinion, that John Connor could be considered as an important character! 5 out of 6 found this valuable. Do you? |
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Accept |
36. RE: TSCC SEASON 3: YOU WRITE THE STORY! (part 2)
Jun 21 2009, 2:11 PM EDT
"Derek enters the room and pulls up a tattered and bent metal chair, sitting on it backwards, he smiles softly at Allison, "He's still out, huh?"As the door shuts, Derek walks over and starts shaking JC he rolls over to see Derek morph in to Catherine Weaver now wearing Derek's clothes. Weaver "Yes these are actually that mans clothes as much as it disgusts me the smell helps the current situation" ".. we don't have much time, I've been unable to acquire John Henry as I feared "they" may not have arrived yet. I set the controls to intercept them as close to a point as possible, but this is where we are at". John takes this all in and remembers Cameron saying she was looking for John in New Mexico for 73 days before acquiring him there......I will be in contact with you shortly John Connor. 7 out of 7 found this valuable. Do you? |
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Timeloop |
38. RE: TSCC SEASON 3: YOU WRITE THE STORY! (part 2)
Jun 21 2009, 2:54 PM EDT
To understand S3 one has to discern the motives of the 3 AI . They went to the future with a complex plan wiht many contingencies. Motives likely inlcude1. Tactical move to escpae attack by Kaliba 2. Find an undamaged chip for Cameron 3. Have John and maybe JH / Cameron interact with Allison 4. Replace Camerons body as a contingency if the damaged body cannot be repaired 5. Return to 2009 as soon as possible The overall strategy of the CW faction which Cameron has joined is to establish trust , friendship and love between humans and cyborgs so that a lasting and effective alliance is possible. In that regards the relationships between JH and Savannah and between Cameron and JC are very important. but as Jesses timeline shows there can be very negative consequences. Allison is the key to understanding the origin of Cameron but also to understanding Cameron's character which is far more insecure than that of JH who does not carry emotional baggage. Jesse wanted to destroy the relationship between JC and Cameron but CW and JH will want to fix it . The character of Allison should have many elements similar to Cameron including insecurity and the whole business surrounding trust and anger. She is brave but psychologically very fragile. 7 out of 8 found this valuable. Do you? |
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Timeloop |
39. RE: TSCC SEASON 3: YOU WRITE THE STORY! (part 2)
Jun 21 2009, 3:05 PM EDT
"Except people from the show have said they are basing it on a string theory. There is only one timeline and each time someone goes back and changes something, the previous timeline is overwritten. Derek goes back in time and kills Andy Goode, his timeline no longer exists and young Derek grows up to be a guy who never knew Billy Wisher and was tortured by Charles Fischer instead of Cameron. The Jesse our Derek knew never exists only the new one who traveled back in time. I don't understand what happened to Jesse's Derek, who was also sent back in time, he may be in LA somewhere hunting Skynet even now. Embrace the paradox!Well that is consistent from the perspective of the traveller who can never know anything about the future of the thread they left anyway. So only one time thread may as well exist from their perspective which is their future which is the only source of travellers that can reach them and with each new traveller arriving their future is changed. Of course the model means travellers carry around memories of timelines that no longer exist whereas in the MW physics model those timelines continue but the traveller is permanently cutoff from them. 5 out of 5 found this valuable. Do you? |
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draconisz |
40. RE: TSCC SEASON 3: YOU WRITE THE STORY! (part 2)
Jun 21 2009, 3:18 PM EDT
1. I dunno about. It seems unlikely.2. That's the consensus. But let us include a chip for JH also. 3. I dunno. Maybe you could explain this. It sounds interesting. But I don't know where that would lead. 4. I would have to agree somewhat. 5. Soon? Time is relative. If he stays in the future a year, it wouldn't matter to the folks in the present day. 5 out of 5 found this valuable. Do you? |
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Accept |
41. RE: TSCC SEASON 3: YOU WRITE THE STORY! (part 2)
Jun 21 2009, 3:20 PM EDT
| Post edited: Jun 21 2009, 3:40 PM EDT
"1:The overall strategy of the CW faction which Cameron has joined is to establish trust , friendship and love between humans and cyborgs so that a lasting and effective alliance is possible. In that regards the relationships between JH and Savannah and between Cameron and JC are very important. but as Jesses timeline shows there can be very negative consequences. Allison is the key to understanding the origin of Cameron but also to understanding Cameron's character which is far more insecure than that of JH who does not carry emotional baggage. Jesse wanted to destroy the relationship between JC and Cameron but CW and JH will want to fix it . The character of Allison should have many elements similar to Cameron including insecurity and the whole business surrounding trust and anger. She is brave but psychologically very fragile. "1:) We don't know what motivates CW beyond a wish to stop Skynet, which she has mentioned. We have no evidence to show that Cameron is now working with Weaver. In fact it looks like she has fled from Weaver and JC. 2:) Jesse's timeline is irrelevant, you say so yourself. Whatever may have been is gone and will never occur , the timeline we are concerned with is the one we are watching on the show. 3:) The terminator franchise is not about making a peace with terminators/cyborgs. These are imperfect creatures with ingrained instructions to kill humans. Thats why a reprogrammed terminator will always choose self destruction in the end, so that mankind may survive. This is a war where we must defeat Skynet, not form an alliance. Weaver may understand this, humanities inherent right to live on this Earth. And that is her goal, not her own survival but ours. Liquid terminators may be more like a new being than anything a terminator could ever become. But there is so much unknown about them , who knows. 6 out of 6 found this valuable. Do you? |
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Timeloop |
42. RE: TSCC SEASON 3: YOU WRITE THE STORY! (part 2)
Jun 21 2009, 3:54 PM EDT
"1:) We don't know what motivates CW beyond a wish to stop Skynet, which she has mentioned. We have no evidence to show that Cameron is now working with Weaver. In fact it looks like she has fled from Weaver and JC.Whatever Cameron did it had JH approval and Weaver knows about it. They even used a plot artifice in Born to Run to explicity show that CW and JH were linked. 5 out of 5 found this valuable. Do you? |
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arthur1920 |
43. RE: TSCC SEASON 3: YOU WRITE THE STORY! (part 2)
Jun 21 2009, 6:00 PM EDT
"Both. The fact that they're in two places at once doesn't change a thing. For those who have an understanding of physics, there is no separation between past, present and future. It's like asking, which one of me has the soul-- the me of yesterday, the me of today, or the me of tomorrow? They are all one and the same."if they are both the same and you kill one then both die. 5 out of 5 found this valuable. Do you? |
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TOK792 |
46. RE: TSCC SEASON 3: YOU WRITE THE STORY! (part 2)
Jun 21 2009, 6:48 PM EDT
"Whatever Cameron did it had JH approval and Weaver knows about it. They even used a plot artifice in Born to Run to explicity show that CW and JH were linked. "Weaver didn't know about it until she discovered JH missing and Cameron's chipless body in his place. She believed Cameron was going to terminate JH. And no, they weren't linked. JH "tweaked" after a piece of his hardware was replaced. Yes, it appears that they are thinking along the same lines, but that doesn't mean they are linked in the way you suggest. It may be that JH is simply more susceptible to suggestion after the swap-out, which would be why he agreed with CW on a point and echoed her words. JH has proven on many occasions that he is free from CW's influence, as he keeps secrets from her and defies her wishes. Besides, a wireless connection between the two isn't possible. If she were another T-888, then maybe. 5 out of 5 found this valuable. Do you? |
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bambow |
47. RE: TSCC SEASON 3: YOU WRITE THE STORY! (part 2)
Jun 21 2009, 6:53 PM EDT
"Weaver didn't know about it until she discovered JH missing and Cameron's chipless body in his place. She believed Cameron was going to terminate JH. And no, they weren't linked. JH "tweaked" after a piece of his hardware was replaced. Yes, it appears that they are thinking along the same lines, but that doesn't mean they are linked in the way you suggest. It may be that JH is simply more susceptible to suggestion after the swap-out, which would be why he agreed with CW on a point and echoed her words.I don't see how this will result in a good story.. I'd rather start sketching out some big-picture points, like what's weaver's agenda, what happened between Cameron & John Henry, what's Cameron hoping with giving up her chip (and, isn't her personality stored in that chip? did she take over John Henry's body, and does that mean it's possible to put John Henry in control of her body? Who helped with that?), that sort of thing. Also, AFAIK we don't know the rules about time travel - are there alternate timelines? If you get into the "wrong" timeline is it possible to get back? It seems to me Weaver's the same as said "the answer is no" in the sub; She's a rogue terminator that's gone to the past to try to prevent the war by changing skynet so it cares about humans from it's beginning, and John Henry is part of her efforts to figure out how to do that. I don't understand the trip to the future, but I suspect it's not far enough into the future for John to have become the leader - which would mean Kyle still has his coat. Maybe this trip is how the resistance gets tipped off that the machines are working on time travel, and John goes back to the past.. or maybe there's enough time before the machines get time travel for him to rise to power without ever going back. Either way, I like the idea of John Henry, perhaps with help from Ellison, taking over a different body (e.g. the one thrown from the balcony), and growing into Weavers idea of preventing the war by changing skynet, but without Weaver he can't do it fast enough, so war starts in the familiar way, but John Henry works from within skynet to help the humans, including making the T2 terminator available to the humans, and eventually creating Weaver. Alternatively, with John Connor missing, John Henry could take on his name, and lead the resistance. Maybe he could do both at once 5 out of 5 found this valuable. Do you? |