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Aaronalxzdr
Terminators are Androids not Cyborgs
Jun 21 2009, 11:27 AM EDT | Post edited: Jun 21 2009, 11:27 AM EDT
This is the one thing that's always bugged me about the franchise. My biggest pet peeve. Cyborgs (cybernetic or cybernetically enhanced organisms) are by definition living things whose physiology has been modified in some way by technology. An android, on the other hand, is an anthropomorphic machine, something created to look and act human.

Marcus Wright is the first actual cyborg created by the franchise. Cameron, as much as we all adore her, is an android. Had Skynet done to Allison what it did to Marcus, Cameron would then be a cyborg. As her character stands she's basically a very unique machine, a sophisticated android able to emulate, and perhaps experience to some degree, human behavior.

Granted, cyborgs and androids are mostly fictional creations, but time will tell how long that remains the case. 5  out of 5 found this valuable. Do you?    

PyroDude
1. RE: Terminators are Androids not Cyborgs
Jun 21 2009, 12:31 PM EDT | Post edited: Jun 21 2009, 12:31 PM EDT
Yes. But how many people know that? A cyborg is also dependent, IIRC, on its living parts to function.

Though if one wants to stretch the definition one could call terminators 'cyborgs' because they need their skin to function properly in infiltration. Do you find this valuable?    
nyccine
nyccine
2. RE: Terminators are Androids not Cyborgs
Jun 21 2009, 12:51 PM EDT | Post edited: Jun 21 2009, 12:51 PM EDT
Skin is an organ, and furthermore, is the largest by a fair margin. You're trying to draw up a distinction without a difference. 1  out of 3 found this valuable. Do you?    
randomicity912
randomicity912
3. RE: Terminators are Androids not Cyborgs
Jun 21 2009, 12:54 PM EDT | Post edited: Jun 21 2009, 12:54 PM EDT
Actually, Cameron is a gynoid. 2  out of 2 found this valuable. Do you?    
tk1000
tk1000
4. RE: Terminators are Androids not Cyborgs
Jun 21 2009, 1:09 PM EDT | Post edited: Jun 21 2009, 1:09 PM EDT
glad somebody agrees with me, i was arguing this last year! 1  out of 1 found this valuable. Do you?    

Aaronalxzdr
5. RE: Terminators are Androids not Cyborgs
Jun 21 2009, 1:27 PM EDT | Post edited: Jun 21 2009, 1:27 PM EDT
"Yes. But how many people know that? A cyborg is also dependent, IIRC, on its living parts to function.

Though if one wants to stretch the definition one could call terminators 'cyborgs' because they need their skin to function properly in infiltration."
True. A living organism needs both components of its physiology to survive, organic and technological. A machine would not necessarily need organic tissue to survive since it isn't alive biologically. Not having its organic component would impair its ability to pass for human. 1  out of 1 found this valuable. Do you?    

Aaronalxzdr
6. RE: Terminators are Androids not Cyborgs
Jun 21 2009, 1:28 PM EDT | Post edited: Jun 21 2009, 1:28 PM EDT
"Skin is an organ, and furthermore, is the largest by a fair margin. You're trying to draw up a distinction without a difference."
You're right about the skin, but you lost me at the end. 1  out of 1 found this valuable. Do you?    

Aaronalxzdr
7. RE: Terminators are Androids not Cyborgs
Jun 21 2009, 1:31 PM EDT | Post edited: Jun 21 2009, 1:31 PM EDT
"Actually, Cameron is a gynoid."
Gynoid? Sounds like an STD. lol j/k Do you find this valuable?    
Accept
Accept
8. RE: Terminators are Androids not Cyborgs
Jun 21 2009, 1:37 PM EDT | Post edited: Jun 21 2009, 1:37 PM EDT
Kyle Reece said they are advanced cyborgs back in 1984, I can live with that cannon. They look like us hair,skin and they sweat and have bad breath ! Hopefully Cameron does not, 1  out of 1 found this valuable. Do you?    

Aaronalxzdr
9. RE: Terminators are Androids not Cyborgs
Jun 21 2009, 1:37 PM EDT | Post edited: Jun 21 2009, 1:37 PM EDT
"glad somebody agrees with me, i was arguing this last year!"
One could argue that since cyborgs are fictional there's no real restriction on the word. But in sci-fi the word is almost universally applied to characters who at their core are living beings.

Contrast Star Trek characters Cmdr. Data, an android, with Seven of Nine the Borg. Android and cyborg. Do you find this valuable?    

Aaronalxzdr
10. RE: Terminators are Androids not Cyborgs
Jun 21 2009, 1:40 PM EDT | Post edited: Jun 21 2009, 1:40 PM EDT
"Kyle Reece said they are advanced cyborgs back in 1984, I can live with that cannon. They look like us hair,skin and they sweat and have bad breath ! Hopefully Cameron does not,"
Yeah, but Kyle Reese was 8 yrs. old on J-Day, so technically he never got past 2nd grade. lol Do you find this valuable?    
R.Daneel_Olivaw
R.Daneel_Olivaw
11. RE: Terminators are Androids not Cyborgs
Jun 21 2009, 1:48 PM EDT | Post edited: Jun 21 2009, 1:48 PM EDT
"Gynoid? Sounds like an STD. lol j/k"
Andro and Gyno are prefixes from greek that mean male and female, respectively. Funny how the connotaions are different these days. Do you find this valuable?    
MetalShifter
MetalShifter
12. RE: Terminators are Androids not Cyborgs
Jun 21 2009, 1:55 PM EDT | Post edited: Jun 21 2009, 1:55 PM EDT
I don't wanna be the "dick of the day", but what is this all about? This thread has been started bei a J (no offense). There is a classic Novel: "Do Androids Dream of electric sheep" by Philip K. Dick, on which Bladerunner is based on. These so called "androids" are far more human than Cameron ever has been. They even had Sex. So what is the concrete point you are reffering to? Do you find this valuable?    
R.Daneel_Olivaw
R.Daneel_Olivaw
13. RE: Terminators are Androids not Cyborgs
Jun 21 2009, 2:00 PM EDT | Post edited: Jun 21 2009, 2:00 PM EDT
"I don't wanna be the "dick of the day", but what is this all about? This thread has been started bei a J (no offense). There is a classic Novel: "Do Androids Dream of electric sheep" by Philip K. Dick, on which Bladerunner is based on. These so called "androids" are far more human than Cameron ever has been. They even had Sex. So what is the concrete point you are reffering to?"
Its only a matter of semantics. Do you find this valuable?    

PyroDude
14. RE: Terminators are Androids not Cyborgs
Jun 21 2009, 2:20 PM EDT | Post edited: Jun 21 2009, 2:20 PM EDT
I've rarely seen 'gynoid' used outside of Japanese creations. I think even shows like TNG used android to describe female robots. Gynoid sounds like it is implying something naughty. Do you find this valuable?    

Aaronalxzdr
15. RE: Terminators are Androids not Cyborgs
Jun 21 2009, 2:22 PM EDT | Post edited: Jun 21 2009, 2:22 PM EDT
"Andro and Gyno are prefixes from greek that mean male and female, respectively. Funny how the connotaions are different these days."
You're right, but most people are only familiar with the andros prefix and the word android. Do you find this valuable?    
ScotWithOne_t
ScotWithOne_t
16. RE: Terminators are Androids not Cyborgs
Jun 21 2009, 2:24 PM EDT | Post edited: Jun 21 2009, 2:24 PM EDT
"Marcus Wright is the first actual cyborg created by the franchise. Cameron, as much as we all adore her, is an android. Had Skynet done to Allison what it did to Marcus, Cameron would then be a cyborg. As her character stands she's basically a very unique machine, a sophisticated android able to emulate, and perhaps experience to some degree, human behavior."
This is what i originally thought Cameron was. I think it may have been a cool route fo the show to take, and certainly would have made the John/Cam shipping much more believable. Up until AFP aired, it certainly could have been that way. But as it turns out, she is just a plain-Jane T-800 style Terminator with a few technological upgrades (smarter chip, ability to eat, color vision etc.)

Maybe that would be a good AU fanfic for someone to write. Kind of follow T4 continuity. The Marcus Wright project failed, but Skynet had one more "true" cyborg prototype to use. Hell... it wouldn't even have quite so AU if you assumed that Skynet made the android Cameron Phillips, then used the dead body of Allison Young to build a Marcus-style cyborg.

Sorry... getting off topic and allowing my imagination to ramble... Do you find this valuable?    

Aaronalxzdr
17. RE: Terminators are Androids not Cyborgs
Jun 21 2009, 2:26 PM EDT | Post edited: Jun 21 2009, 2:26 PM EDT
"I don't wanna be the "dick of the day", but what is this all about? This thread has been started bei a J (no offense). There is a classic Novel: "Do Androids Dream of electric sheep" by Philip K. Dick, on which Bladerunner is based on. These so called "androids" are far more human than Cameron ever has been. They even had Sex. So what is the concrete point you are reffering to?"
What's "bei a J"?

I was making a distinction between cyborgs and androids, and pointing out how cyborg is technically incorrect for describing Terminators.
Do you find this valuable?    
MetalShifter
MetalShifter
18. RE: Terminators are Androids not Cyborgs
Jun 21 2009, 2:29 PM EDT | Post edited: Jun 21 2009, 2:29 PM EDT
"What's "bei a J"?

I was making a distinction between cyborgs and androids, and pointing out how cyborg is technically incorrect for describing Terminators.
"
Sorry!!! It just didn't get the point! My bad! Sorry!!! Do you find this valuable?    
CamDer
CamDer
19. RE: Terminators are Androids not Cyborgs
Jun 21 2009, 2:29 PM EDT | Post edited: Jun 21 2009, 2:29 PM EDT
"This is the one thing that's always bugged me about the franchise. My biggest pet peeve. Cyborgs (cybernetic or cybernetically enhanced organisms) are by definition living things whose physiology has been modified in some way by technology. An android, on the other hand, is an anthropomorphic machine, something created to look and act human.

Marcus Wright is the first actual cyborg created by the franchise. Cameron, as much as we all adore her, is an android. Had Skynet done to Allison what it did to Marcus, Cameron would then be a cyborg. As her character stands she's basically a very unique machine, a sophisticated android able to emulate, and perhaps experience to some degree, human behavior.

Granted, cyborgs and androids are mostly fictional creations, but time will tell how long that remains the case. "
This is something my brother, Thecomputerw, tried to make but he was booed out of Dodge. Do you find this valuable?    
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